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Women leading prayer/making adan amongst men


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#1 Guest_leb_cutie15_*

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Posted 29 October 2003 - 06:52 AM

                    asalammu-alayakom...

I am new to islamway.com, and mashallah this site is amazing!! This site has helped me in every way possible and many things have been clearified to me due to reading articles and questions posted on islamway.com. I shared the information that i had learned from off this site to some other muslims in my school, and found that many muslims in my school had no knowledge of Islam. This inspired me to write a propsal to my principal for a muslim group in our school; aiming  to clarify and clear misunderstandings of Islam within the non-Muslim population in my school and to provide Muslim students a relaxed, open atmosphere to (re)discover and learn about their faith. Al7amdulilah all went well and the principal agreed to the group with no hesitation/second thoughts. I am now the head organizer of this group called MSA (muslim students association) in my school.

MSA is still in the process of planning things such as debates, question/answer sessions, iftars in ramadan, etc, and I was hoping I could get some help from some of the sisters here on the forum. I had a student who didnt have too much knowledge about islam approach one of the VP organizers with a question about prayer. They asked ...

  "..Can women lead prayers with both men and women praying? If not, why?" And " Why cant women make adan, is it because it is all tradition and the women in islam never had rights??"

The VP organizer answered the question by saying that women were allowed amongst women, but didnt have proof with them from the quran/hadiths to show that it was not allowed amongst men as well. The VP organizer didnt argue it furthermore and delayed this for a group discussion which we will have inshallah this friday after Juma prayer.

The VP organizers and I have had a meeting and we are all trying to get as much proof from the quran/hadiths before friday so we can put it together for friday.

If I could PLEASE get replys to this with lots of proof from the quran and hadiths Id be more than thankful!! Thank you for you precious time,and I wish everyone all the best in Ramadan and may allah (swt) lead you on the right path..


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#2 muslimsister

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Posted 29 October 2003 - 08:02 AM

                    Assalaam alaikum wa rahmatu Allah,
This fatwa should give you some more information.  
Welcome to the site sister.  
Question :


In Islam, can a woman be an imaam in a mosque? What are the conditions for a woman to be an imaam?

Answer :

Praise be to Allaah.

It is not permissible for a woman to lead men in prayer. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Keep women behind [in the back rows] as Allaah has commanded.” (Narrated by ‘Abd al-Razzaaq in his Musannaf, 5115. The isnaad stops at Ibn Mas’ood with a longer report than this; the isnaad is saheeh but it is not proven that this was said by the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)).

  Moreover, the position of imaam in the mosque is a kind of wilaayah [public office], and wilaayah is only for men. “No nation prospers that appoints a woman over its affairs [wilaayah]” (narrated by al-Bukhaari, 13/45, 46), as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said.

  There is an exception made by the Hanbalis, but this is a weak opinion. This view says that a woman may lead the men in taraaweeh if she reads well and the men present are illiterate, but she should be behind them and they should be in front of her. But there is no evidence (daleel) to support this view. The point is that it is not permissible for a woman to lead men in prayer. Yes, women may lead other women in prayer, it is OK if she leads other women. This is fine, as stated in the report of Umm Waraqah leading some of her mahrams, but as for her leading non-mahram men or as a public office [wilaayah], such as being an imaam in a mosque, this is not permitted.



  Fataawa Samaahat al-Shaykh ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Humayd, p. 130 (www.islam-qa.com)                    

#3 muslimsister

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Posted 29 October 2003 - 08:03 AM

                    Assalaam alaikum wa rahmatu Allah,
Question :


Please can you tell me if it is obligatory for women to call the iqamaah before they pray alone or in congretion with other sisters.

Answer :

Praise be to Allaah.  

The Standing Committee for Issuing Fatwas was asked: Is it prescribed in sharee’ah that a woman should say the iqaamah when she is leading other women in prayer?

They replied:

It is not prescribed for women to say the iqaamah for prayer, whether they are praying individually or one woman leads the others in prayer, just as it is not prescribed for them to say the adhaan.

Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah, 6/84

Shaykh Ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) was asked: Is it permissible for a woman to do the adhaan and iqaamah for prayer or not?

The shaykh replied:

It is not prescribed for women to pronounce the adhaan or iqaamah for prayer, rather that is for men. Neither the adhaan nor the iqaamah is prescribed for women, rather they should pray without the adhaan or the iqaamah.

Majmoo’ Fataawa wa Maqaalaat Mutanawwi’ah, 10/356.

And Allaah knows best.



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Posted 29 October 2003 - 08:42 AM

                    asalammu-alayakom...

First of all, I'd like to say JazakiAllahou khayran for replying to my email. I am actually very happy that I have recieved a reply so quickly  :oops: . I was just wondering another thing though...is there any proof of this in the Quran besides the proof in the hadith :?: ??

The student who had asked this question happened to be "shia" (shee3a) and from my knowledge about "shia's", they have completely different understandings/beliefs/morals/values in islam than "sonnis" would. I know for a fact, that this particular student will try to argue this point and make this more of a DEBATE rather than a discussion. I fear that this will confuse other muslim students in the discussion and will cause a problem. This student is very stubborn with their opinion and will fight right/left to prove themself right. I also recall the VP organizer saying to me that this student didnt believe that all hadiths were correct; which would lead us organizers to try and get something out of the Quran about it .

Any suggestions on how I can better handle the situation and make sure that it is not turned into a religious debate on which group is the "right" group would be much appreciated. Again JazakiAllahou khayran for your time and effort in replies; this means alot as I am trying to make this MSA a successful organization, one that will last even after I graduate.

Your Muslim Sister,
                    

#5 muslimsister

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Posted 29 October 2003 - 06:07 PM

                    Wa alaikum assalaam wa rahmatu Allah,
Sister, as you know, we take our religion from both the Qur'an and sunnah, so not everything regarding our religion is in the Qur'an.  Just think about our prayers, we know the proper way they are performed from the sunnah.  It sounds like you may be dealing with someone that rejects the sunnah.  A Muslim must accept both to be a Muslim.
The following fatwa gives proofs from the Qur'an that we must follow the Prophet, peace and blessings of Allah upon him.
Question :


If a person's family rejects the necessity of following anything that's in hadeeth at all, and says you can follow only the Qur'an, can you give them salaams and say "Eid Mubarak" to them to reduce fitnah and not make them upset?.

Answer :

Praise be to Allaah.  

Firstly:

Every Muslim has to believe in all the ahaadeeth of the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) – if they are saheeh – and not reject any of them, because his ahaadeeth and his Sunnah are revelation (wahy) from Allaah. Whoever rejects the hadeeth of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) has rejected revelation from Allaah.

Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“By the star when it goes down (or vanishes).

Your companion (Muhammad) has neither gone astray nor has erred.

Nor does he speak of (his own) desire.

It is only a Revelation revealed.

He has been taught (this Qur’aan) by one mighty in power [Jibreel (Gabriel)].

One free from any defect in body and mind then he (Jibreel — Gabriel in his real shape as created by Allaah) rose and became stable”

[al-Najm 53:1-6]

Allaah has commanded the people to obey His Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). He has enjoined this in many verses of the Qur’aan, of which we will quote some. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say (O Muhammad): “Obey Allaah and the Messenger (Muhammad).” But if they turn away, then Allaah does not like the disbelievers”

[Aal ‘Imraan 3:32]

“He who obeys the Messenger (Muhammad), has indeed obeyed Allaah, but he who turns away, then we have not sent you (O Muhammad) as a watcher over them”

[al-Nisa’ 4:80]

“O you who believe! Obey Allaah and obey the Messenger (Muhammad), and those of you (Muslims) who are in authority. (And) if you differ in anything amongst yourselves, refer it to Allaah and His Messenger, if you believe in Allaah and in the Last Day. That is better and more suitable for final determination”

[al-Nisa’ 4:59]

“And perform As‑Salaah (Iqaamat‑as-Salaah), and give Zakaah and obey the Messenger (Muhammad) that you may receive mercy (from Allaah)”
[al-Noor 24:56]

And there are many similar verses.

The one who rejects the Sunnah is a kaafir and an apostate.

Al-Suyooti (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in his essay Miftaah al-Jannah fi Ihtijaaj bi’l-Sunnah:

Note that whoever denies that the hadeeth of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), whether it describes his words or deeds, so long as it meets the conditions outlined by the scholars, may be quoted as evidence, is a kaafir and has gone beyond the pale of Islam; he will be gathered with the Jews and the Christians or whomever Allaah wills among the kaafir sects [i.e., on the Day of Resurrection].

Those who want to restrict themselves to the Qur’aan only are called al-Qur’aaniyyoon. This view of theirs is an old view which the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) warned against in more than one hadeeth, as we shall see below. Among the soundest evidence that this view is false is the fact that those who say this do not really follow what they say.

How do these people pray? How many times do they pray each day and night? What are the conditions and details of zakaah? What is the nisaab (threshold of wealth) for paying zakaah? What is the amount that must be paid? How do they do Hajj and ‘Umrah? How many times do they circumambulate the Ka’bah? How many times do they go back and forth between al-Safa and al-Marwah?

There are many other issues the details of which are not narrated in the Qur’aan, rather they are mentioned in the Qur’aan in general terms, and the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) explained them in detail in his Sunnah.

Would these people refrain from acting upon these rulings because they are not narrated in the Qur’aan?

If their answer is yes, then they have passed judgement against themselves that they are kaafirs, because they have denied a basic principle of Islam that no Muslim has any excuse for not knowing and on which there is unanimous consensus among the Muslims.  

If they reply that they do not refrain from following these rulings, then they have demonstrated that their view is false.

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said – after quoting the verses that enjoin following the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) –  

These texts enjoin following the Messenger even if we do not find what he said specifically referred to in the texts of the Qur’aan. These verses also enjoin following the Qur’aan even if we do not find what is said in the Qur’aan specifically mentioned in the hadeeth of the Messenger.

So we must follow the Qur’aan and we must follow the Messenger. Following the one implies following the other, for the Messenger conveyed the Book, and the Book commands us to follow the Messenger. The Book and the Messenger do not contradict one another at all, just as the Book does not contradict itself. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Had it been from other than Allaah, they would surely, have found therein many a contradiction”

[al-Nisa’ 4:82]

And there are many ahaadeeth from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) which state that it is obligatory to follow the Qur’aan and that it is obligatory to follow his Sunnah, for example, the hadeeth in which he said: “I do not want to find any one of you reclining on his pillow, and when he hears of something that I have commanded or forbidden, he says, ‘Between us and you there stands this Qur’aan, whatever we find is permissible in it we will take as permissible, and whatever we find is forbidden in it we will take as forbidden.’ For I have been given the Book and something like it with it; it is like the Qur’aan or more.” This hadeeth is narrated in the books of Sunan and Musnad from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) with a number of isnads from Abu Tha’labah, Abu Raafi’, Abu Hurayrah and others.

In Saheeh Muslim is it narrated from Jaabir that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said in his Farewell Sermon: “I am leaving behind among you something which, if you adhere to it, you will not go astray after that. It is the Book of Allaah.” The version narrated by al-Haakim says “The Book of Allaah and my Sunnah.” (Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, 2937).

In al-Saheeh it is narrated from ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Abi Awfa that it was said to him: Did the Messenger of Allaah leave a will? He said, No. It was said, How then is it prescribed for people to make wills when the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did not make a will? He said, He made a will in which he enjoined (adherence to) the Book of Allaah.

(Narrated by Muslim, 1634)

The Sunnah of the Messenger of Allaah explains the Qur’aan, as it explains the number of prayers, how much should be recited in them, which should be recited out loud and which quietly. It also explains the amounts of zakaah to be paid and the threshold at which zakaah becomes due; the rituals of Hajj and ‘Umrah; how many times one should circumambulate the Ka’bah, go between al-Safa and al-Marwah and stone the Jamaraat, etc.

When any Sunnah is proven to be saheeh, the Muslims are agreed that it is obligatory to follow it. There may be something in the Sunnah which a person thinks appears to go against the apparent meaning of the Qur’aan and add to it, such as the Sunnah which explains the threshold of stealing at which the hadd punishment becomes due, and the Sunnah which stipulates that the married adulterer is to be stoned. This Sunnah must also be followed, according to the view of the Sahaabah and those who followed them in truth, and all the groups of Muslims.

Adapted from Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 19/84-86

That which was brought by the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) is true just as the Qur’aan is true.

Secondly:

You should not forsake your family; rather you should treat them kindly and strive to call them to follow and accept the Sunnah.

Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Invite (mankind, O Muhammad) to the way of your Lord (i.e. Islam) with wisdom (i.e. with the Divine Revelation and the Qur’aan) and fair preaching, and argue with them in a way that is better. Truly, your Lord knows best who has gone astray from His path, and He is the Best Aware of those who are guided”

[al-Nahl 16:125]

“And We have enjoined on man (to be dutiful and good) to his parents. His mother bore him in weakness and hardship upon weakness and hardship, and his weaning is in two years give thanks to Me and to your parents. Unto Me is the final destination.

But if they (both) strive with you to make you join in worship with Me others that of which you have no knowledge, then obey them not; but behave with them in the world kindly, and follow the path of him who turns to Me in repentance and in obedience. Then to Me will be your return, and I shall tell you what you used to do”

[Luqmaan 31:14-15]

And Allaah knows best.



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